Comments on: France Foto: Did Anybody Catch This?

By: kaya

kaya — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 02:44:18 +0000

Even if he’s normally a good guy, he probably was engaging in jibing. I don’t see it as a problem, to be honest, it’s boys being boys in the heat of battle. I feel bad for Abidal: he looked like a deer caught in headlights from the beginning. I don’t see what the problem is with Laurie posting the photo, though I don’t think it merits a verdict on Cannavaro’s peronality. Everyone wanted to know what Materazzi said to Zidane, and I’m sure we’d all be interested to know what was communicated when this photo was taken.
As far as jeering the Marseillaise goes, the Italian fans did it in qualifying, so I expect they did it in this game (I didn’t catch the first few minutes of the broadcast). The French do get a lot of abuse from people who don’t even know why they dislike the them, and people like Italy and they don’t even know why. I’ve had some pretty amazing discussions with american soccer fans (this usually means non-U.S. origin) about why they can’t stand France. Really bizarre stuff some of them have heard about some of the players.
I never met a single french person until after I went to university. While I didn’t really have an opinion one way or another, I grew up knowing they were supposed to be snotty people. So yeah, I’d say the U.S. is generally pretty francophobic. People here have no problem saying things about the french that would be considered racist about any other group, but they love everything Italian. It’s just bizarre.

By: Jean Pierre

Jean Pierre — Sun, 22 Jun 2008 18:22:46 +0000

typical Italian way of playing soccer

By: Foreverzidane

Foreverzidane — Sat, 21 Jun 2008 07:11:02 +0000

I applaud Laurie for initiating such a thread as it does generate
discussion, not everyone has to agree or disagree with what sandrahn and I are saying! We’re just exposing and shedding light to another frequent occurance during these international competitions where we live.
Now it’s obvious most of these players are familiar with each other on a more personal level but that in no way diminishes the rivalry or the will to go all out for your country. So yes the Italian players were sincerely concerned with the injury to Ribery, but would they voluntarily send off
let’s say TONI to make it an even match? HELL NO!
Thanks Laurie.

By: sam

sam — Sat, 21 Jun 2008 06:04:26 +0000

laurie, once you checked the youtube video and clearly saw gattuso, pirlo and zambro near ribery, you should have changed your post…this kind of speculation and incendiary posting just encourages country bashing and makes the problems between the 2 countries’ fans worse…
i am neither french nor italian and this post frankly seems more like british tabloid reporting – speculation on what a pic which is just a snapshot in time means – just to encourage more comments and very unlike either the offside or you personally…

By: Doumé

Doumé — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 19:27:03 +0000

Marco P, basically the TV camera angle was facing Abidal, and for the most part, he was looking down as he was walking, then raised his eyes for about a second as he passed the Italian bench, as if called or something, then had no reaction or expression at all and kept going. Don’t ask me why I keep this game on tape

Sandrahn, clearly the Marseillaise was badly booed (without mutual disrespect), unlike against the Dutch or Romanians. And I hope you find good bars for the World Cup! Thanks for telling your experience.

By: sandrahn

sandrahn — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:40:30 +0000

Foreverzidane, I have the same sort of experience here in Brooklyn–I live very close to an Italian neighborhood known for being very rightwing and racist (black kids who walked thru there in the 80s and 90s were routinely assaulted, at least 2 were killed). During the wc, I had to stop going to two bars that I frequent to watch football games because some of the worst elements of these nationalistic Italians were there. It was very painful to listen to them talk about the French national team in ways that shocked me deeply—I thought I had stepped into a time machine and walked into Mussolini’s Italy. What was worse was non-Italian Americans joining them because of the obsessive hatred of France in this country. None of these people even followed football, certainly not the Italian league. They didn’t even know their own players very well. It was just an opportunity to spew hate and indulge in chest-pounding nationalism. I know full well they are not representative of the Italian nation as a whole (I lived in Italy for 3 years and there’s a very vibrant activist community there fighting against racism) but unfortunately it’s the worst elements who I was most exposed to at the time.

By: Foreverzidane

Foreverzidane — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:37:53 +0000

Here in Canada I’ve grown up with many Italians, and never have I ever
had a personal grudge as regards to where they come from! As the matter of fact I still regard Fachetti as one of the greatest Midfielders who ever played the game. However the more of a fan I’ve become of the Les Bleus since the Tresor era, the more hatered and anger I’ve seen coming from the Azzuri fans, always taunting when they are victorious, even showing up to the French lounge where we watch the matches with their friends just to be total KNOBS! I mean they have the whole part of College st (little Italy) and a good portion of St.Clair which is theirs, not to mention the entire suburb of Woodbridge, meanwhile the French have absolutely no community here in Toronto, no Arrondismont that you could call little France.
These are the types of Italians we have here! Mind you the rivalry of Italians and Portugese is even nastier and more personal in Toronto.
When their team wins they all have their flags and the streets I mentioned gets closed off with proper Police supervision, and you forget you’re living in Toronto, Canada. So the Italian national fervor for many of them whom don’t even know how put a proper sentence together in Italian, comes alive every two years! Hey be happy but lets call it the way it is and don’t throw PASTA SAUCE at us French supporters.

By: Laurie

Laurie — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 16:02:32 +0000

Glatisant! I was just wondering where you’d been these Euros!

By: glatisant

glatisant — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:59:36 +0000

The picture doesn’t bother me. Maybe Cannavaro meant to be nice, maybe he was caught at a bad angle and was really gesturing at one of his teammates on the field, maybe he was taunting Abidal. Who knows.
If the situation had been reversed, and it had been, say, Thuram taunting an Italian, yes, I’d feel embarrassed.
If it had been Domenech, I’d probably crack up. (Actually, if Cannavaro did this to Domenech, I’d probably crack up too, even as a France supporter.)
Since I don’t know much about Cannavaro as a character, I’m not going to bother deciding between either lenience or outrage. As for how this reflects on his team, since I’m not inclined to like them in any case, why should this picture matter at all?
It matters much more to me that France lost, and lost badly, than anything Cannavaro does on the sidelines.

It seems that since the 2006 World Cup, France, or at least its fans, have had a personal grudge against Italy.
If France fans have had a personal grudge against Italy and yet have refrained from booing their anthem, while Italy fans, who don’t hold a grudge, boo La Marseillaise and throw racial epithets, what does this say about you?

By: sandrahn

sandrahn — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:00:48 +0000

Frank, the grudge and animosity goes both ways equally, I don’t thing you can point only to France fans. We get insults here all the time. And there are lots of Americans and Brits who may not even care about Italy but suddenly become Italy supporters (and the Americans know CRAP about football) because they play against France. These are people with an irrational hatred of France, they’re totally xenophobic against the French and know absolutely NOTHING about the country or its people, its history, its football. We regularly get on this site nazi-like idiots spouting race theories about the French national team, something Italy is not subjected to.