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Thoughts on Le Sélectionneur, Raymond Domenech: Is he the right man to turn it around, or is his sacking ridiculously overdue?

September 8th, 2008 | By: jeff | 37 Comments »

After France’s shocking performance against Austria, losing 3-1 to kick off the World Cup Qualifying campaign, many supporters have turned their thoughts to le sélectionneur, Raymond Domenech, and posed the question: “Why hasn’t he been sacked already?”

Coming on the heels of a woeful Euro 2008 campaign, and a shocking stay of execution, the loss to Austria provides a fitting occasion to reflect on Domenech’s tenure.

With the number of France supporters dwindling who describe Domenech as “The best man for the job,” and calls for him to get the sack having reached fever pitch in some quarters, I find myself wondering when, exactly, he lost fan support. Domenech may still have his backers, and those views are welcomed, but for the rest of you, looking back at these results, when did you lose patience with Domenech?

2006 World Cup Qualifying
Sept. 4, 2004 – France 0, Israel 0
Sept. 8, 2004 – Faroe Islands 0, France 2
Oct. 9, 2004 – France 0, Ireland 0
Oct. 13, 2004 – Cyprus 0, France 2
Mar. 26, 2005 – France 0, Switzerland 0
Mar. 30, 2005 – Israel 1, France 1
Sept. 3, 2005 – France 3, Faroe Islands 0
Sept. 7, 2005 – Ireland 0, France 1
Oct. 8, 2005 – Switzerland 1, France 1
Oct. 12, 2005 – France 4, Cyprus 0
France won the group with 5 wins and 5 draws; 20 points. Switzerland was 2nd with 18 points.

2006 World Cup
June and July 2006
Group G
France 0, Switzerland 0
France 1, Korea 1
Togo 0, France 2
Switzerland won the group with 7 points. France squeaked into the Round of 16 with 5 points, ahead of Korea with 4 points.

Round of 16: Spain 1, France 3
Quarter-final: Brazil 0, France 1
Semi-final: Portugal 0, France 1
Final: Italy 1, France 1 (Italy won on penalties 5-3)

Euro 2008 Qualifying
Sept. 2, 2006 – Georgia 0, France 3
Sept. 6, 2006 – France 3, Italy 1
Oct. 7, 2006 – Scotland 1, France 0
Oct. 11, 2006 – France 5, Faroe Islands 0
Mar. 24, 2007 – Lithuania 0, France 1
June 2, 2007 – France 2, Ukraine 0
June 6, 2007 – France 1, Georgia 0
Sept. 8, 2007 – Italy 0, France 0
Sept. 12, 2007 – France 0, Scotland 1
Oct. 13, 2007 – Faroe Islands 0, France 6
Oct. 17, 2007 – France 2, Lithuania 0
Nov. 21, 2007 – Ukraine 2, France 2
Italy won the group with 29 points. France finished 2nd with 26 points, squeaking into Euro 2008 ahead of Scotland with 24 points.

Euro 2008
June 9, 2008 – Romania 0, France 0
June 13, 2008 – Netherlands 4, France 1
June 17, 2008 – France 0, Italy 2
France finished bottom of the group with 1 point, and was eliminated along with Romania who managed 2 points.

During the post-match interview after the Italy game, Domenech proposed to his significant other, Estelle Denis; a proposal that was as well-received as his management of the French team.

2010 World Cup Qualifying
Sept. 6, 2008 – Austria 3, France 1

Next up:
World Cup Qualifier
Wednesday, Sept. 10, 2008 – France v. Serbia

Would a resounding victory there change your view?

I’ve been lukewarm about Domenech for so long, it’s hard to remember. I thought it was a good idea to promote the manager of the Under-21s, so I was enthusiastic initially. I think it was this result that dampened my enthusiasm quite a bit: Oct. 9, 2004 – France 0, Ireland 0; and this result that killed off my enthusiasm entirely: Mar. 30, 2005 – Israel 1, France 1. France were 4th in the qualifying group at this point, group behind Ireland, Switzerland and Israel, and I was ready for a change.

But this is when Domenech went through his good stretch. He received a lot of credit for bringing back Zidane and Makalele in April of 2005 and qualifying for the 2006 World Cup. And although the first two games of that World Cup were dreadful, France were world beaters against Togo, Spain, and Brazil, and for most of the match against Italy. These results really throw a wrench into the Domenech narrative, and his defenders have some strong ammunition for their arguments from this period: going from 4th in the qualifying group to the World Cup Final. There’s always a thought, now, that Domenech can find a way to turn things around, however much that successful World Cup run fades in the memory.

No one appreciated the results against Togo, Spain, and Brazil more than me (the less said about that Portugal semi-final the better), but those matches aside, I haven’t been in love with Domenech’s reign.

The fact that I’ve been lukewarm about Domenech for so long, I think, takes the edge off my disappointment from results like the 3-1 loss to Austria.

So you’ve had my answer: I would have sacked Domenech after the March 30, 2005 draw with Israel, right before the return of Zidane and Makalele. Would I have been right? Another manager might have brought back Zidane and Makalele – who knows what might have happened?

I’m not one of those who is actively rooting for Domenech to get the sack now, because the last time I had those thoughts, France went on to the World Cup final, and I’m not convinced that his replacement, Dider Deschamps, or even Arsene Wenger, would necessarily turn things around right away. Something in my gut tells me that Sir Alex might be a good man to run the side, but that seems too improbable to merit consideration.

If you’re one of the people calling for Domenech to get the sack, when did you lose faith? Get it out now before France’s 6-0 victory over Serbia.

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Comments

Displaying the most recent 25 comments from a total of 37 comments.

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By Jean-Michel | September 8th, 2008 at 7:54 pm

He’s had two years to figure out the Benz/Henry thing out. I appreciate what you’re trying to do Jeff and I agree with Toulalan being a positive but I think the problem lies with his tactics not player selection. France is blessed with world class talent so he never really has to look far to find it. Putting together a solid game plan is where he has totally failed.

Posted from United States

By Michel-Olivier | September 8th, 2008 at 7:57 pm

@ french fans
did you guys know serbian striker nikola zigic is 2.02-meter(6-foot, 7 1/2-inch) tall.

Posted from United States

By Jean-Michel | September 8th, 2008 at 7:57 pm

no. is he good?

Posted from United States

By jeff | September 8th, 2008 at 8:09 pm

He’s slow to figure stuff out.

What are his tactics or his game plan? Other than choosing a formation, I can’t really discern a plan – which might be the problem. For the Austria game, was it the plan for Diarra to try all those long passes over the top, none of which worked?

I’m far from the camp that thinks another loss or two is worth it to see the back of Domenech, and I’m not in the camp that believes that any of the candidates who have been touted would necessarily bring instant improvement, so I’m hoping that things will turn themselves around, that Doms will stumble onto a system that works.

A big win is what’s need to get the confidence rolling.

By Jean-Michel | September 8th, 2008 at 9:01 pm

I’m more of the camp that once supported Domenech for having the stones to draw a line in the sand and say “this is my team”. Today that team doesn’t work. For awhile it hasn’t. I’m in the camp thats tired of barely qualifying for tournaments, countless draws, losing because of weak attacking,losing because of weak defending, winning on penalties to teams we should be blowing out,etc, etc…

Posted from United States

By Michel-Olivier | September 8th, 2008 at 9:09 pm

@ JM
on wednesday he will be

Posted from United States

By Benjamin | September 9th, 2008 at 12:23 am

Im thinking the team will rebound with a 2-0 victory.
lets stay positive.

the tactics plan against austria that went wrong was constantly playing things in the air when
austria’s defense compacted. Austrians r big and tall, and it shounld take a genius to have quick passing and piercing runs into the center from the flanks from ppl like nasri, or play the through balls to henry. Domenech doesnt do that, he wants a slow buildup to attacks, with the defense nice and organized before launching an attack.
This is the difference between Domenech and an attacking coach like Wenger. This type of style is what we need imo.

By Nikola | September 9th, 2008 at 6:03 am

If Serbia defeats France, the entire FFF should resign. While I believe in the qualities of my team, history tells for itself – Serbia nor Yugoslavia (from 1992 onward) have never defeated any of the world superpowers. True, we’re also not losing so easily in the qualifiers: in the last three competitions Serbia hasn’t lost a singe game agaist two of the main contenders, and we played games against Portugal, Spain and Italy. I’ll be writing a game preview at the Serbia WCB, you might check it out if you’re interested in what’s going on in the enemy’s camp and look at the game from a different perspective.

By Terry from Naples Fl | September 9th, 2008 at 9:21 am

I feel @ this point does it matter if they win, as long he is the coach they will loose soon enough,I would after the game fire him NO ONE WILL OBJECT France can be a super power again…………..allez Deschamps

Posted from United States

By metamoralia | September 9th, 2008 at 9:48 am

This is just speculation but …

… I’m not sure we can blame Domenech for the current state of the French NT.

If this team were really his team, if he was the one making key decisions, he would have been fired last July. I suspect he does what he’s told–by the FFF, by Escaletes, and is perhaps something of a puppet for them. After all, they voted something like 18-2 to keep him on. Clearly, something else was at work that had not much to do with his abilities.

That may be the only reason for having maintained him.

If so, crying for Domenech’s head is futile. The rot lies deeper: with Escalates and the FFF itself.

I think we will know this when Domenech is let go–inevitably, before or after the upcoming Romania game–and the FFF puts in his place someone relatively untested and whom they can control like Boghossian or someone more independent like Deschamps.

Posted from Canada

By Luc | September 9th, 2008 at 9:51 am

I agree with jdkbrown’s remark earlier. I think Domenech’s best result was the 3-1 against Italy; and even then, you feel that the sheer desire for vengeance from the team did the job there. France got to the WC final in 2006 because Zidane was on another skill planet for the second half of the tournament (and Make and Tutu of course). I never felt like it was Raymond’s coaching ability.

The ideal situation now would be that France wins against Serbia and that regardless of the win, RD gets the sack, nom de dieu. But that’s not so likely. I’ll get back to my Heineken and daydreaming…

Incidentally, l’Equipe is alleging that the FFF kept with Domenech because they absolutely did not want anyone from the outside (Deschamps)or to bow to the media/98 lobby. To me Deschamps is the obvious choice for a million reasons…

Posted from Thailand

By metamoralia | September 9th, 2008 at 9:51 am

It’s interesting to look at the stats Jeff has provided …

… what worked for France—however often dismal to watch—is not working now: defense.

France gave up only two goals in ten games during the WC06 qualifiers …

Even in the Euro08 qualifiers France gave up only five goals in twelve games.

In its last four games (the Sweden friendly included) France has allowed eleven goals.

Posted from Canada

By sandrahn | September 9th, 2008 at 11:04 am

Excellent thread.

metamoralia, I thought your speculation was absolutely fascinating and opened up a new line of thinking for me–Domenech being a puppet of the FFF, following their orders re team selection/tactics.

I know precious little about Domenech’s work with the youth teams in terms of style and tactics, just superficial stuff I read in various press articles. Is there any substantial difference between his approach with the senior team v. the youth team?

Posted from United States

By metamoralia | September 9th, 2008 at 11:41 am

Hi Sandrahan,

Your question is very interesting, and while I wish I could offer an informed comment, I just don’t know–my deep interest in the French NT (and in football, in general) goes back only a few years. In my readings, I’ve not seen anything about that at all.

Jeff had something above to say about Domenech and the youth team. Perhaps he, or some other contributors, might comment on your question.

I just wiki’d Domenech, and see he was the u-21 coach from ‘93-’04. I had no idea he was there for that long.

• 1994: Losing semi-finalists. Finished fourth.
• 1996: Losing semi-finalists. Finished third.
• 1998: Did not qualify. Finished 2nd of 5 in qualification group.
• 2000: Did not qualify. Finished 1st of 5 in qualification group. Lost qualification play-off.
• 2002: Runners-up.
• 2004: Did not qualify. Finished 1st of 5 in qualification group. Lost qualification play-off.

I don’t know if he was the coach at the time of 2004 tournament, but I add it anyway … His teams did either very well, but never winning anything—or not well at all, which if nothing else seems to mirror his time with the NT!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raymond_Domenech

Posted from Canada

By Jamie | September 9th, 2008 at 2:07 pm

hey michel-olivier! why are you being such a .. and why did you compare france football team to england football team? france is not overrated – in fact most of the world under rates it after the bad oaching. England is very much overrated – most of the ‘golden generation’ don’t even shine for their clubs..

Posted from United Kingdom

By Jean Pierre | September 9th, 2008 at 2:16 pm

Wow that are interesting and impressing analyses in the comments!! things i never could think of
- im impressed:D

and upset because france is playing crap with a crap coach

lets look to the match with the serbs tomorrow

If you got this channel: EuroSport 1
You can watch France – Austria
Not live, but it is something else than Justin TV

Posted from Netherlands

By Seb | September 9th, 2008 at 2:20 pm

On the plus side, our U-21 team qualified for the playoffs! YEAH!

To metamoralia, excellent thinking. I did not describe it as well as you did, though earlier, during the summer and before the July general counsel, I described Domenech as a bit of a “made man,” like in the mafia. He is persona grata at the FFF, and it would take, well, A LOT for Escalettes (there are people who think Escalettes will resign if we don’t win tomorrow) to get rid of him. Of course, we are now in a situation where everyone’s head is close to the guillotine, though there’s no doubt it’s Estelle Denis’ main squeeze who would be on the chopping block first.

Michel-Olivier, I’m impressed at your knowledge of Serbian players. I’m actually more afraid of the Serbian midfield, as I think a midfield of Stankovic, Kuzmanovic, Jankovic, etc. is definitely one which, considering we’re without Vieira, could make considerable problems to our own. Zigic will be a danger on set pieces, to be certain, though.

By Jean Pierre | September 9th, 2008 at 2:24 pm

Wow that are interesting and impressing analyses in the comments!! things i never could think of
- im impressed:D
and upset because france is playing crap with a crap coach
lets look to the match with the serbs tomorrow
If you got this channel: EuroSport 1
You can watch NOT France – Austria,
but France – Serbia
Not live, but it is something else than Justin TV so check out your old american tv;s

i wonder what the line up will be tommorow though with domenech it wont be surprising

Posted from Netherlands

By Seb | September 9th, 2008 at 2:45 pm

Some thoughts after analyzing the performance of our U-21 team today and whether any of those guys will have an impact on qualification.

Even though he is out injured at the moment, it is more than likely that PSG’s Mamadou Sakho (who is surclassé, that is, while he should be a U-19, he’d in the U-21 Bleuet team) will be a starter in Bleu, though if they don’t rush him, about 3 years, and he’ll be among the best defenders in the world.

Habib Bellaïd, if he can be more consistent, also has a shot.

Loïc Rémy is able to pose issues to any defense.

Frédéric Nimani has done well this season, he remains very unpolished, though.

Erick Mombaerts should not be among the candidates to replace Raymond Domenech, as we appear to be having the same issues with his teams (difficulty to score, questionable selections, and so on).

By Benj | September 9th, 2008 at 4:27 pm

You should go to the l’ Equipe web site. They released transcripts of the deliberations at the FFF and why they decided to keep Domenech. It’s all about politics, not wanting somebody from “outside” (like Deschamps) to take over, using Domenech as the “fall guy” in case the team doesn’t qualify for WC. Absolutely putrid stuff. They should all be fired: Houllier, Escallettes, and the rest of those clowns.

Posted from United States

By Laurie | September 9th, 2008 at 5:58 pm

Benj, do you have a link? Unless I catch something while it’s on the front page of the l’Equipe website, I always have a hard time searching out articles there. Thanks!

Posted from United States

By Benj | September 9th, 2008 at 6:42 pm

Laurie

can’t find the link anymore on lequipe.fr. It seems to have disappeared…
However, here is a link from LeMonde referring to it:

http://www.lemonde.fr/sports/article/2008/09/09/pourquoi-domenech-est-maintenu-a-la-tete-des-bleus_1093390_3242.html

By Benj | September 9th, 2008 at 7:09 pm

Here’s an even better one:

http://www.lemonde.fr/sports/article/2008/09/09/un-fusible-nomme-raymond-domenech_1093019_3242.html

By Michel-Olivier | September 9th, 2008 at 8:41 pm

bring back the guillotine because someone(you know who) head is going to be on the scaffolding.

Posted from United States

By Benjamin | September 10th, 2008 at 12:30 am

i think a little prayer for our boys is appropriate at this stage.

ribery is training again and should be good as new end of september, so we will def have him back for the next set of internationals! Thtas something good to look for before our inevitable loss to (is it) serbia