Patrice Evra is Unhappy with French Fans

This is not news to anyone who knows anything about French football — but it’s also not news to anyone who knows anything about football world wide. Evra is quite wrong to think that France is unique.

It’s the capital city syndrome, and Paris just doesn’t have a football culture. As you say, if you go to other parts of France, you don’t get this attitude. In England they call it the “prawn sandwich brigade.” Arsenal unfortunately gets a LOT of these types of fans at the Grove (aka, the Emirates stadium) and we therefore have one of the most miserable home crowds in European football. Our away fans are fantastic, tho). These “fans” view football as diverting entertainment, a night out with the family, nothing more. They’re not real, rock-solid supporters. In London and Paris it’s often associated with fans who of a certain upper middle to upper class mentality. The England national team gets booed all the time at Wembley.

In Rio, our national team gets the same treatment. Rio isn’t our capital city anymore but it’s more of an urban center of culture than Brasilia is — and more populous. Recent games in Rio and Sao Paulo (also not a great local crowd), our 2 biggest cities, have had poor results for our nat’l team, all goalless draws. In October our NT held a friendly v. Portugal in a small satellite town outside Brasilia, which is a more remote part of the country. We beat Portugal 6-2! First time in 4 games our NT scored at home!

During the 2007 rugby world cup, I was not the only one who commented that France’s semifinal v. England should not have been held in Paris but Toulouse — France’s center of rugby. I really think France would’ve won that semifinal had it been held in Toulouse. I think sometimes the Paris crowd can be so miserable that it gives bad luck to the national teams of both sports.

The French aren’t going to cheer just because the team shows up.

If the French think the players are under-performing, they have a moan; that’s part of being French, may it never change.

The problem is that the players and manager often under-perform. The French watch the French players put in fantastic performances for their clubs in the Champions League, but play like they have some sort of mental block when playing for France. It’s infuriating.

Booing after 5 minutes, though, is extreme. That’s petulant, and that’s not demonstrating a good appreciation or understanding of football. For those people, I would say Evra is probably right that they don’t like football. Those people are a problem.

But not waving flags to celebrate the players? The French are connoisseurs. If they’re cheering, it’s because something was too good not to take notice, and it’s a well-earned cheer.

When you’re at a dinner party in France, you don’t celebrate when the meal is served. If something is exquisite, it’s worthy of comment, but with such a strong tradition of excellence, something has to be really good to get excited.

A cheer from a Parisian crowd is harder-earned than most, and the more valuable for it. If France put in performances that match their potential, the fans will be overjoyed, singing the Marseillaise in unison, and celebrating in the streets.

So while I’m in partial agreement with Evra that some people are a problem, I would argue that the French Supporters who save their celebrations for a worthy moment are just being good citizens.

Booing players off the pitch is a touchy subject, and it’s been a big talking point for Arsenal Supporters this season. If the neighborhood grocery store sells me spoiled milk once or twice, I can probably deal with the situation with civility, but about the third time, I would notice a pattern, and hopefully I would say something about it. When France are really poor for a sustained period, I can understand the motivation to boo them off the pitch, but I would encourage everyone to boo sparingly, ESPECIALLY before full time, because it could quickly become counterproductive. Who would want to be the moron booing for 90 minutes before France makes a brilliant breakthrough to win a match?

Cutting and pasting a comment on Bigsoccer, as I think it’s pretty representative of the fans’ side of it:

“I hate the generation of players we have in the national team. Those guys want to be idolatred while they are in the stadium, don’t want people to disturb them outside of the stadium with signs or this kind of stuffs. They want big money as well, it’s never big enough, though. They suck (and Evra sucks badly, he should learn what “defense” means) on the pitch, play with no will, and yet we do not have the right to criticize them, they want to do shopping instead of trainning. They are full of themselves as well… It’s so hard being a professional football player, I pity them.

Those players are as pathetic as their coach. They ask for patriotism while they always seek for more money and go abroad to taste the taxes of England and now they ask to be supported ? Come on, except Rothen, can anyone name a player who chose the club he supports instead of the money of some british club ? No, because that’s impossible to find any of them. Where is their patriotism when them and their entourage are so greedy ? In their wallet, perhaps. Look at Sinama Pongolle, he forgot that he has heard monkey chants in Spain for the money of Atletico during the Santos affair. They have no pride.

If they are jeered by the supporters that’s because the players, the coach, the FFF, the League are always insulting the fans. Domenech is still in charge even though he failed, is incompetent, proposed to Estelle Denis after the loss against Italy and a 5 years old kid would communicate better than he. No one wants him to remain, yet he is still here. Thiriez said that France losed in the Euro because of the fans. Of course…If during a National team A’ (something which disappeared) match, we’ve heard supporters and banners whinning about the lack of tickets for the fans to go to the Euro, that’s probably their fault. For the FFF, it’s more interesting to have agreements with some companies and giving it away to the VIP. Don’t whine that there are no french fans then.

Next time, the supporters should say they are fantastic even when they’re losing to Austria. Evra will be happy.

The supporters of the national team are probably not the best, but these players and coach don’t deserve anything better.”

I think people see cynicism on the part of the federation and the players, and they’re responding with cynicism. As far as the decision to retain Domenech is concerned, I can’t say I blame them.

I don’t think it’s fair to blame the players for going where the money (and competition) is, when it’s more a structural problem than anything else. What do you guys think of the perception that “the younger generation lacks character”? How much of this is plain nostalgia (French players have been leaving for other leagues long before this generation arrived in any case), how much is attributable to the media (I’m sure the locker room disputes we heard so much about during Euro ‘08 didn’t help impressions here), and how much of it actually has basis in reality?

But not waving flags to celebrate the players? The French are connoisseurs. If they’re cheering, it’s because something was too good not to take notice, and it’s a well-earned cheer.

From my (foreign and limited) perspective, I’m used to the impression your average French citizen appears more likely to be a casual fan/bandwagoner than a die-hard supporter when it comes to the NT. While that may be unfortunate, it’s not such a bad thing when it precludes some of the more hideous strains of jingoism that crop up with more regularity elsewhere.

But the cynicism does seem like something new, yes. Sandra, the match Evra referred to took place at the Vélodrome, so you can’t say it’s just a Paris thing anymore.
I agree with Laurie that while some of the contempt may be justified, it doesn’t solve any problems (if public outcry after the Euros didn’t get Domenech fired, I doubt it has much effect now) and will probably just make the players feel more alienated, demotivated, what have you. It’s just a bad cycle all around.

Guys,ifor one will have to side with French football fans..Obviously, they are patriotic and when their team is made up of 90% of players NON GALLIC and of African descent, they naturally feel for it..

Another ignorant, racist comment from this 9chumpsleague moron.

I wondered how long it would take for the racists like that to pop up.

Its not that simple 9CL … as you probably need reminding there were great celebrations throughout France–the largest since liberation from the Nazis–when the ‘98 team won the WC.

One of the great things about that team was its composition of players from so many ethnic identities. In that sense it more accurately represents what it means to live in a contemporary society almost anywhere in the West today …. including France.

And if today’s team is mostly black–so what? It only shows that professional sports is at its best an arena of merit rather than misplaced racial identity.

Incidently, the word “gallic” – your polite eumphemism for “white” – is an adjective pertaining to either ancient Gaul or something French in the most general sense. It’s not a signifier of an imagined purely race-based cultural identity.

@ 9 champs leagues
france = caledonian, basque, reunionnais, breton, mahoran, catalan, corsican, occitan, french polynesian, french antillean, alsatian……….

“La France est une Republique indivisible, laique, démocratique et sociale. Elle assure l’égalite devant la loi de tous les citoyens sans distinction d’origine, de race ou de religion. Elle respecte toutes les croyances. Son organisation est décentralisee.”(Constitution)

@ steven
zidane, nasri, and benzema are african, are they black?

Well played, M-O.

But I think you answered your own question.

People, countries, cultures are far too complex to reduce to one single identity. We are and have been for some time a mix of different influences, backgrounds, etc.

Barack Obama is the most obvious contemporary example of this.

One of things that unites us with all our distinct multi-lingual/cultural/racial backgrounds–at least in Western democracies–1s a shared, legally-based conception of citizenship, which transcends the specificities of our individual backgrounds.

And of course France–as you so rightly note–has helped lead the way in this regard …

im the perfect supporter evra

@ Sandra – we miss you so much over at LJ! don’t you like us anymore? we wish you would visit or say hello. It’s been ages!

lots of love and hugs all around!

Why shouldn’t the French team be booed of the pitch at Velodrome (or anywhere in France) after losing 2-0 and offering a listless display of football?

@ aditya: because you support your badplaying team as a handicapped friend through thick and thin especially when they are bad to let them play less bad *nodding sagely*

Domenech used to look like borat and took away the one good thing about France: trezeguet.

Why shouldn’t the French team be booed of the pitch at Velodrome (or anywhere in France) after losing 2-0 and offering a listless display of football?

It’s not a question of “should” or not, but what the booing is meant to do and whether it’s effective.
If the goal is to vent frustration, sure. If it’s to impact the way the team is playing (say five minutes into a game, or in the midst of a tense qualification campaign), I’m not sure it’s working here.

I don’t necessarily have an objection to booing on a philosophical level, just a pragmatic one in this case.

Absolutely agree with Evra, specially when playing at Stade de France, as I attended the qualifier against Serbia. I am not a native of France but to those who have been born there don’t you have an ounce of pride? Regardless of the money hungry villains they maybe as the rest of us are so pious, wouldn’t you like to see Les Bleus succeed? Do you think for a second that in Buenos Aires a giant flag of Zidane would survive till the end of the match? I highly doubt it! It’s better not to show up at all than be a making fools of yourselves cheering “ole” for each passing plays of the opposition.
You not only become annoying to Les Bleus but a joke to the world.
Discuss POLITICS or what “Carla was wearing” in the stands instead, your favorite subjects,… non? I hope that this team under Domenech will make it to the world cup and prove all you naysayers wrong!